Discussion:
Stupidest game of the month. 11 move Mate.
(too old to reply)
Sanny
2008-07-12 11:21:40 UTC
Permalink
I played Beginner. I played Handicap Level and got a Knight Extra.

At GetClub with Handicap Level you can turn any level with a Knight/
Bishop/ Rook/ Queen Extra.

I thought that beginer without a Knight will be easy for me to win.

But when I played the game Beginner gave me Check Mate even without a
Knight.

And that too in just 11 Moves.

Rember I was having a Knight Extra. Still Beginner was able to win the
game.

Game Played between sanjay11 and beginner_x_N at GetClub.com

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
sanjay11: (Black)
beginner_x_N: (White)
Game Played at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
View Recorded Game: http://www.getclub.com/playgame.php?id=DM22495&game=Chess
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

White -- Black
(beginner_x_N) -- (sanjay11)

1. e2-e4{0} e7-e5{10}
2. Nb1-c3{16} Nb8-c6{4}
3. Bf1-c4{8} d7-d6{4}
4. Qd1-h5{12} g7-g6{14}
5. Qh5-f3{6} Ng8-f6{8}
6. Nc3-b5{10} a7-a6{4}
7. Nb5-c7{6} Qd8-c7{8}
8. Qf3-f6{8} Rh8-g8{12}
9. c2-c3{6} Bf8-e7{8}
10. Qf6-f7{6} Ke8-d7{16}
11. Bc4-e6{2}
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
sanjay11: (Black)
beginner_x_N: (White)
Game Played at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
View Recorded Game: http://www.getclub.com/playgame.php?id=DM22495&game=Chess

So you can see even with a Knight down Beginner is tough on me.

Bye
Sanny

Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
tOmmetje
2008-07-12 13:30:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Sanny
I played Beginner. I played Handicap Level and got a Knight Extra.
At GetClub with Handicap Level you can turn any level with a Knight/
Bishop/ Rook/ Queen Extra.
I thought that beginer without a Knight will be easy for me to win.
But when I played the game Beginner gave me Check Mate even without a
Knight.
And that too in just 11 Moves.
Rember I was having a Knight Extra. Still Beginner was able to win the
game.
Game Played between sanjay11 and beginner_x_N at GetClub.com
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
sanjay11: (Black)
beginner_x_N: (White)
Game Played at:http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
View Recorded Game:http://www.getclub.com/playgame.php?id=DM22495&game=Chess
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
White -- Black
(beginner_x_N) -- (sanjay11)
1. e2-e4{0} e7-e5{10}
2. Nb1-c3{16} Nb8-c6{4}
3. Bf1-c4{8} d7-d6{4}
4. Qd1-h5{12} g7-g6{14}
5. Qh5-f3{6} Ng8-f6{8}
6. Nc3-b5{10} a7-a6{4}
7. Nb5-c7{6} Qd8-c7{8}
8. Qf3-f6{8} Rh8-g8{12}
9. c2-c3{6} Bf8-e7{8}
10. Qf6-f7{6} Ke8-d7{16}
11. Bc4-e6{2}
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
sanjay11: (Black)
beginner_x_N: (White)
Game Played at:http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
View Recorded Game:http://www.getclub.com/playgame.php?id=DM22495&game=Chess
So you can see even with a Knight down Beginner is tough on me.
Bye
Sanny
Play Chess at:http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
Well DUH, of course Beginner easily wins from you even when down a
knight. Your chess skills are even worse than your programming skills.
Sanny
2008-07-12 15:48:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by tOmmetje
Well DUH, of course Beginner easily wins from you even when down a
knight. Yourchessskills are even worse than your programming skills.- Hide quoted text -
There is one Baby level which is even weak than Beginner. I am unable
to win the Baby Level also.

Now, I will try Baby Level with Extra Knight. If I fail I will get
Extra Rook against Baby Level.

Once can take Extra Queen/ Rook/ Bishop / Knight with any of the
levels. Still they are very strong.

Bye
Sanny

Play Chess at:http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
Tobias Heidelmann
2008-07-12 16:11:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Sanny
Post by tOmmetje
Well DUH, of course Beginner easily wins from you even when down a
knight. Yourchessskills are even worse than your programming skills.- Hide quoted text -
There is one Baby level which is even weak than Beginner. I am unable
to win the Baby Level also.
Now, I will try Baby Level with Extra Knight. If I fail I will get
Extra Rook against Baby Level.
Once can take Extra Queen/ Rook/ Bishop / Knight with any of the
levels. Still they are very strong.
Bye
Sanny
Play Chess at:http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
Dude, are you serious?
this makes me very curious.. i mean, you openly admit that you have
virtually no understanding of chess whatsoever and YET you are writing
some chess software? how do you do that?
your software must use some algorithm to evaluate a given position. As
you cannot do that yourself,how do you teach a computer? do you use
other existing algorithms?

Tobias
Sanny
2008-07-12 16:47:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tobias Heidelmann
Dude, are you serious?
this makes me very curious.. i mean, you openly admit that you have
virtually no understanding ofchesswhatsoever and YET you are writing
somechesssoftware? how do you do that?
your software must use some algorithm to evaluate a given position. As
you cannot do that yourself,how do you teach a computer? do you use
other existing algorithms?
See I know all rules of Chess. But when I play a game I make so many
mistakes that I am never able to win Beginner Level. It takes my
pieces like birthday cake.

I have good understanding of Chess by getting Help Bot suggestions. He
has helped me a lot. Thats the reasion I seek help from people on the
group. Help Bot suggestions and analysis help me understand the
weaknesses in the game.

Now, I do not find any thing wrong with the game. Yes it makes a few
illegal moves that needs to be corrected.

Beginner Level used to play better than me the first day the program
was launched. I was so happy 2 years back but players on this group
beat it like cucumber and sliced and eat it.

I am just 1100 rated as per the players here. I often play using
Rybka help. Then I am able to beat even the Easy and Normal Levels.

Bye
Sanny

Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
Tobias Heidelmann
2008-07-12 17:16:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Sanny
See I know all rules of Chess. But when I play a game I make so many
mistakes that I am never able to win Beginner Level. It takes my
pieces like birthday cake.
I have good understanding of Chess by getting Help Bot suggestions.
the reason i asked you ist because i am a student of computer science.
game theory in general is of some interest to me. Unfortunately you did
not reply to my other message concerning GetClub and open source. Have
you thought about that option?

And i am still curious. Do you want to reveal some internals of your
engine? The main question is, how do you compare two positions. ( i mean
positions when the engine has left the opening book)
Say, position A and a position B which is a couple of moves away from
position A. Do you compare material? possibilities of tactics (pins,
forks, ets.), and also, how do you weigh the possible moves. Which move
is more probable to occur in the game? how do you answer that question?

did you write your engine from scratch? or did you start with some
existing engines?

Greetings,
Tobias
Guest
2008-07-12 17:25:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tobias Heidelmann
Post by Sanny
See I know all rules of Chess. But when I play a game I make so many
mistakes that I am never able to win Beginner Level. It takes my
pieces like birthday cake.
I have good understanding of Chess by getting Help Bot suggestions.
the reason i asked you ist because i am a student of computer science.
game theory in general is of some interest to me. Unfortunately you did
not reply to my other message concerning GetClub and open source. Have you
thought about that option?
I doubt that he has.

He's rather secretive about his program. Not sure if it's shame or
arrogance.
Post by Tobias Heidelmann
And i am still curious. Do you want to reveal some internals of your
engine? The main question is, how do you compare two positions. ( i mean
Many people have asked him about some internal details, and he always
ignores the question.

I think he's so secretive because he believes he's such a good programmer
and his chess program is so good that he's right on the verge becoming
internationally famous and rich. (And unfortunately, I'm not joking....)
Post by Tobias Heidelmann
positions when the engine has left the opening book)
Say, position A and a position B which is a couple of moves away from
position A. Do you compare material? possibilities of tactics (pins,
forks, ets.), and also, how do you weigh the possible moves. Which move is
more probable to occur in the game? how do you answer that question?
Considering Sanny has said he knew nothing about computer chess when he
started, and that he has done no research during this time, it's uncertain
as to what kind of program structure he has. (Do we believe him about his
lack of research.... I think most of us do, else the program would have
progressed much faster.)

I have some suspicioun that it might even be selective search. That would
explain the tactical blunders that people talk about regularly. He's trying
to look at the plasible moves and is missing the tactical stuff because they
don't apear reasonable at first glance.

Unless the program is incredibly buggy (which is possible), a brute force
with just a tiny bit of knowledge would be expected to play substantially
better.
Post by Tobias Heidelmann
did you write your engine from scratch? or did you start with some
existing engines?
Considering the quality of play and that it's still making illegal moves and
tactical blunders, it is safe to say that he started from scratch with
little to no knowldge of chess programming.
Post by Tobias Heidelmann
Greetings,
Tobias
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Sanny
2008-07-12 17:58:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Guest
I have some suspicioun that it might even be selective search. That would
explain the tactical blunders that people talk about regularly. He's trying
to look at the plasible moves and is missing the tactical stuff because they
don't apear reasonable at first glance.
Unless the program is incredibly buggy (which is possible), a brute force
with just a tiny bit of knowledge would be expected to play substantially
better.
I am very satisfied with the Game GetClub is playing. I only wanted it
for general Players and not to compete with Fritz & Rybka which are
the leaders in Chess.

GetClub is just a penny in front of these Big programs.

GetClub Chess is not for competing with Chess Engines but only for
fun. and people wishing to pass there time playing Chess.

Bye
Sanny

Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
Tobias Heidelmann
2008-07-12 23:29:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Sanny
Post by Guest
I have some suspicioun that it might even be selective search. That would
explain the tactical blunders that people talk about regularly. He's trying
to look at the plasible moves and is missing the tactical stuff because they
don't apear reasonable at first glance.
Unless the program is incredibly buggy (which is possible), a brute force
with just a tiny bit of knowledge would be expected to play substantially
better.
I am very satisfied with the Game GetClub is playing. I only wanted it
for general Players and not to compete with Fritz & Rybka which are
the leaders in Chess.
GetClub is just a penny in front of these Big programs.
GetClub Chess is not for competing with Chess Engines but only for
fun. and people wishing to pass there time playing Chess.
Bye
Sanny
Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
instead of simply ignoring my questions concerning the internals of your
program it would be much nicer if you just said something like "no, i do
not reveal anything, my program is my big freaking secret"

greetings
Tobias
Patrick Volk
2008-07-13 04:00:59 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 13 Jul 2008 01:29:58 +0200, Tobias Heidelmann
Post by Tobias Heidelmann
Post by Sanny
Post by Guest
I have some suspicioun that it might even be selective search. That would
explain the tactical blunders that people talk about regularly. He's trying
to look at the plasible moves and is missing the tactical stuff because they
don't apear reasonable at first glance.
Unless the program is incredibly buggy (which is possible), a brute force
with just a tiny bit of knowledge would be expected to play substantially
better.
I am very satisfied with the Game GetClub is playing. I only wanted it
for general Players and not to compete with Fritz & Rybka which are
the leaders in Chess.
GetClub is just a penny in front of these Big programs.
GetClub Chess is not for competing with Chess Engines but only for
fun. and people wishing to pass there time playing Chess.
Bye
Sanny
Play Chess at: http://www.GetClub.com/Chess.html
instead of simply ignoring my questions concerning the internals of your
program it would be much nicer if you just said something like "no, i do
not reveal anything, my program is my big freaking secret"
It's in Java, I bet you could find it off his site... If he does
security like he (er, I'm sorry, his *team*) programs.
Post by Tobias Heidelmann
greetings
Tobias
Sanny
2008-07-13 07:06:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by Patrick Volk
Post by Tobias Heidelmann
instead of simply ignoring my questions concerning the internals of your
program it would be much nicer if you just said something like "no, i do
not reveal anything, my program is my big freaking secret"
It's in Java, I bet you could find it off his site... If he does
security like he (er, I'm sorry, his *team*) programs.
In case someone does it I will do all needed to put him 10 years in
Jail (Prision) And ask 1 million Dollar as Fine.

Patrick Volf are you a hacker? ***@comcast.net Your email is with
me If you do any thing wrong I will catch you.

This group is full of Hackers. Save yourself !!!

Bye
Sanny
zzz
2008-07-13 11:32:14 UTC
Permalink
Sanny, you misunderstand. People are asking for your source code so
they can help you make improvements and find bugs, not to steal
anything.
Right now you don't have anything worth stealing anyway. If you let
people help you, maybe some day you will.
Tobias Heidelmann
2008-07-13 16:58:28 UTC
Permalink
sorry, i cannot resist this. Your empty threats annoy me too much.
because you used a similar threat in a reply to me, i will respond to this.

But first, let me say that i do not think Patricks reply was nice. If
Sanny does not want to share, thats ok. It